19 replies to this topic

[Aaron]

It has always bugged me how Mr. Earle was made a villain in Batman Begins. He seemed to have done a good job with Wayne Enterprises over the years. Then suddenly he goes into heavy arms manufacturing after deciding to take the company public. I know much of it was for the sake of the story, and for Bruce to get his company back, but it always seemed lazy.

Earle wants to pursue guns as a corner stone of Wayne Enterprises. Not enough? He's taking the company public. Still like him? He thinks Batman needs a straight jacket. Still there? Don't worry he thinks he's smarter than Bruce. Hang on there Earle fans, egg in your face coming because he just fired your beloved Lucious Fox for just about no reason. Total villain transformation now!

It was just lazy. Like he did well for 20 years then all of a sudden does a complete 180.

Thoughts on this? What bugs you guys from Begins and TDK?

[Elwood Hemingway]

TDK? That kid accountant who figured out who Batman is. Sure, his first thought might have been to blackmail Bruce, but I mean, that's a tempting thought, his second course of action was doing what he thought was right, expose Wayne to save the city. Sure Bruce went out of his way to save him and protect his own identity, but now you got this young hot shot out there who knows how Bruce spends his evenings. I would have done a bit more with him. After the movie what happens to him? The entire city knows that he knows who Batman really is, yet they just leave that hanging? Sloppy.

[Aaron]

I've never thought of that. Seems like he's have to make an accusation after that or something and be proven wrong. Or that someone would look where he was working and connect the dots.

Maybe Nolan will address it in TDKR. Probably not..

My fiancee loves the bum in BB. She always laughs about how he hasn't aged one single day since Bruce gave him his coat. Despite being homeless and living outside.

[Elwood Hemingway]

It's just a small thing, but I kinda wanted to see Bullock and Montoya in the movies. We had two different characters who seemed to fit their profiles (forget their names), but both ended up being the corrupt cops in their respective movies. Also, whatshisname, the cop from Year One that's basically like Gordon's right hand man.

On a different note, it's been a few years since I seen the first one, but the kid that lazy-eye Rachel saves... isn't that Gordon's son? He looks like the kid who played Jimmy Jr. in TDK, but I can't quite remember if that was mentioned in BB or not.

[Dark Knight]

Flass is straight from Year One already, he was never a Bullock.

[Elwood Hemingway]

That's right too. My bad. Except Year One Flass was way cooler. BB Flass just sorta looked like Bullock, but with longer hair.

[Aaron]

I would have loved to see Gordon kick Flass' ass in Begins

[M'onel]

Elwood Hemingway, on 08 August 2011 - 02:22 PM, said:

Also, whatshisname, the cop from Year One that's basically like Gordon's right hand man.

Merkel. Such an odd name yet such a dependable cop. I was waiting for Gordon to call him out.

Re-watching Begins, I'm beginning to see why Darren and Kyu dislike the Nolanverse. Almost no mention, nor even hint towards any kind of detective training at all. His whole journey seemed more of a moral quest, learning about evil in order to combat it than any kind of knowledge/education journey. Ninja training, no less (Still cool, but would Bale's Batman be considered his World's Greatest Detective?)

Then there's Lucius and his research department. All his gear comes from unmarketed tech developed by Wayne Enterprises. Makes sense to a degree but also undercuts how resourceful and skilled Bruce is when it comes to his equipment. Plus, I find it hard to believe that no one else stumbled across this miraclous stuff before Bruce and did something else with it entirely.

[Aaron]

But Bruce does show us a level of detective work in Begins. He finds Gordan, he gets the photos of Judge Faden, uncovers Falcone's plan to kill Rachel. Then in TDK he finds the finger print from the bullet, he finds that apartment being used during the funeral. I agree he's not the World's Greatest Detective from the comics, but he's got some training from somewhere. Possibly college he studied crime scene forensics, or when he was abroad.

I don't mind that he uses Lucious or Wayne tech. He has to start somewhere. This is him in year one remember?

[Dark Knight]

Yeah, they just don't focus on the detective work because it sells more tickets/DVDs as an action flick.

[marhawkman]

Also he talks with Lucius about ways to improve the gear. Lucius is only partially responsible for the creation of the batsuit.

[Aaron]

Here is a revised list of the things Bruce has done in the Nolanverse in regards to creations and detective work

Bruce's Creations

• He turned Lucious' sonar concept into a city wide imager
  
• He added the Batpod to the Tumbler (my assumption).
  
• He took the military suit and improved it by covering it with anti-thermal paint
  
• Turned the memory cloth into a glider
  
• Created the Batcowl and incorporated his earpiece and voice changer
  
• He created Batarangs
  
• He created sonar lenses

Bruce's Detective Work

• Finds Gordon as the only non-corrupt cop
  
• Uncovers dirt on Judge Faden
  
• Finds fingerprint from the bullet
  
• Uncovers Falcone's plan to kill rachel
  
• Helps GCPD take down money launderers with irradiated bills
  
• Finds Lao is the mob's last money laundering sauce
  
• Finds the park side apartment used in the funeral hijack
  
• Knows almost every member of the GCPD (he calls them out when they are trying to save Reese in TDK)

Id say he's pretty crafty. Anything else?

[M'onel]

Most of that can be attributed to Ra's ninja training, scoping out your target, discerning their movements, friends, enemies, allies, formulating plans to kill your target except he doesn't.

But if Gordon had a crime scene, could Bale Batman investigate it well enough to catch the bad guy? I'm not sure.

[Dark Knight]

He seemed pretty sure he could in TDK when he got the bullet out of the wall.

[TEE REV]

forensic science can be self taught, and he spent time doing other things before he was approached by Ras

[Dagwood]

Maybe he went to university and studied criminal justice with a business double?

He's obviously very well educated.

[TEE REV]

my impression as well

[Raúl Gómez]

Something that sometimes bothers me from Frank Miller's stories like Year One is that every character seems to be a real bad-ass muscular guy who could kick everyone's ass and knows how to fight.

[Con-El]

Aaron, on 11 September 2011 - 12:40 AM, said:

Here is a revised list of the things Bruce has done in the Nolanverse in regards to creations and detective work

Bruce's Creations

• He turned Lucious' sonar concept into a city wide imager
  
• He added the Batpod to the Tumbler (my assumption).
  
• He took the military suit and improved it by covering it with anti-thermal paint
  
• Turned the memory cloth into a glider
  
• Created the Batcowl and incorporated his earpiece and voice changer
  
• He created Batarangs
  
• He created sonar lenses

Bruce's Detective Work

• Finds Gordon as the only non-corrupt cop
  
• Uncovers dirt on Judge Faden
  
• Finds fingerprint from the bullet
  
• Uncovers Falcone's plan to kill rachel
  
• Helps GCPD take down money launderers with irradiated bills
  
• Finds Lao is the mob's last money laundering sauce
  
• Finds the park side apartment used in the funeral hijack
  
• Knows almost every member of the GCPD (he calls them out when they are trying to save Reese in TDK)

Id say he's pretty crafty. Anything else?

This actually leads to what bugs me most about the movies.

Christian Bale's voice as Batman. I honestly can't stand it; it annoys me to no end and almost makes me hate every scene with Batman in it. In Batman Begins it wasn't too bad but in The Dark Knight, I dunno, it got so much worse.
An the way your post leads in to that is simply: We're shown how brilliant he can be and all the resources and gadgets at his disposal, and the best solution he can get for masking his voice is talking three octaves lower than normal?

[Darren]

Aaron, on 11 September 2011 - 12:40 AM, said:

Here is a revised list of the things Bruce has done in the Nolanverse in regards to creations and detective work

Bruce's Creations

• He turned Lucious' sonar concept into a city wide imager [Actually, Lucius did that.]
  
• He added the Batpod to the Tumbler (my assumption). [Again, probably Lucius, since we know he built the Tumbler]
  
• He took the military suit and improved it by covering it with anti-thermal paint
  
• Turned the memory cloth into a glider [Going off the first film, Lucius did this]
  
• Created the Batcowl and incorporated his earpiece and voice changer
  
• He created Batarangs
  
• He created sonar lenses [This is the first point again, and still Lucius]

Also:

Quote

• Finds Lao is the mob's last money laundering sauce

Typed from your phone, by chance?