Jump to content


- - - - -

Who commited the Holiday killings in "The Long Halloween"?

Long Halloween Jeph Loeb Tim Sale Holiday Batman Gilda Alberto

5 replies to this topic

Poll: Who commited the Holiday killings in "The Long Halloween"? (0 member(s) have cast votes)

Who commited the Holiday killings in "The Long Halloween"?

  1. Alberto did all the Holiday shootings until he was caught on Labor Day. (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  2. Gilda did the first three. Then Alberto did all the other Holiday killings, up through Labor Day. (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  3. Gilda did the first three. Then Alberto and Harvey each did some of the others before Labor Day. (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  4. Gilda did the first three. But Alberto and "Someone Else" (NOT Harvey) each did some of the others. (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  5. Alberto and "Someone Else" (NOT Harvey or Gilda) both killed people on holidays before Labor Day. (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  6. By Labor Day, there were at least four Holiday killers! Gilda, Alberto, Harvey, and "Someone Else!" (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  7. NONE OF THE ABOVE. (If your interpretation is different, please tell us who killed whom!) (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

Vote Guests cannot vote

#1 Lorendiac

    Pip

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 238 posts

Posted 09 November 2011 - 06:21 PM

In "The Long Halloween," a 13-part miniseries, "Holiday killings" occurred on thirteen separate dates in a year-long period (beginning and ending on Halloween). The mysterious Holiday killer (or just plain "Holiday" for short) always used a .22 automatic to do his (or her, or their) bloody work. (Not the same gun each time, though -- in fact, in most cases the weapon was deliberately left at the crime scene!)

At the end of #12 and the start of #13, we saw Alberto Falcone caught in the act of killing Sal Maroni on Labor Day. Toward the end of #13, we saw Harvey Dent/Two-Face use the same sort of gun to kill Vernon Field and then Carmine Falcone ("The Roman"). So there's no mystery about who committed the "Holiday murders" on Labor Day and on the second Halloween.

Therefore, this poll is focusing on collecting the opinions of Batman fans regarding who were the actual shooters in all the other Holiday murders, before Alberto was captured on Labor Day and started confessing that he was the mysterious "Holiday."

The final and official verdict (of the GCPD, the court system, etc.) appears to have been that Alberto's confession should be taken entirely at face value. From the first Halloween to Labor Day, he and he alone was running around killing people with .22-caliber bullets on holidays.

However, we readers are privy to some information that Batman, Jim Gordon, and millions of other denizens of Gotham never knew. Most importantly, Gilda Dent's Weird Monologue in the final pages of the story. To hear her tell it, she was "Holiday" on the first three occasions (Halloween, Thanksgiving, and Christmas Eve) and then she quit -- and she also seems to believe that her husband Harvey picked up where she left off by perpetrating at least one or two of the other Holiday crimes which occurred before Alberto was captured on Labor Day.

Ever since the miniseries wrapped up on that odd note, there have been periodic arguments among fans regarding just how seriously we should take Gilda's Weird Monologue, and just who should take the rap for each of the Holiday killings! (Although, as I said, I think it's obvious that Alberto did the Labor Day killing, at the very least, and that Harvey was the one running wild with a .22 on the second Halloween.)

Some people believe Gilda started the ball rolling as the original Holiday killer, and Alberto later became a "copycat killer" after she quit.

Some believe Gilda is also correct in thinking Harvey did some of the Holiday killings himself (long before the ones we saw him do in the final issue.)

Other people believe Gilda never shot at anybody in her entire life; she is just getting delusional after the shock of seeing her beloved husband turn into the scarred and murderous villain known as Two-Face.

And occasionally someone argues that one or more of the Holiday killings were committed by someone else entirely, whose name was neither "Alberto," "Harvey," nor "Gilda."

With all that in mind, I just want to take a poll and see how popular each interpretation is at this time -- 14 years after the final issue of the miniseries was originally published.

Don't forget to vote! :)

Appendix: Quick Refresher on Who Died and Who Confessed

If you want your memory jogged before you vote, here's who died (or at least was "the apparent target," even if he survived) in each of the "Holiday shootings"):

#01. Johnny Viti (Carmine Falcone's nephew) was killed on Halloween.

#02. "The Irish," a gang of five men currently working for Carmine Falcone, was wiped out on Thanksgiving.

#03. Milos (Carmine's bodyguard) was killed on Christmas Eve.

#04. Alberto Falcone (Carmine's son) was believed to have been murdered on New Year's Eve, but it turned out to be a fake. (Whether or not Carmine himself knew this all along is far from clear. Batman thinks Carmine must have known, but he offers no concrete evidence of that. We don't know who officially "identified the body," and we don't know who bribed the City Coroner to fill out a fraudulent death certificate. And even if we knew for a fact that Carmine helped fake his son's death, that wouldn't prove he knew his son was planning to run around killing people on holidays afterwards. Carmine could have done this just to "protect" his son from being killed for real by the mysterious Holiday!)

#05. Several of Sal Maroni's hoodlums were killed on Valentine's Day.

#06. A bunch more of Maroni's hoodlums were killed on St. Patrick's Day.

#07. Someone shot a great many bullets in the general direction of The Riddler on April Fool's Day, but not really shooting "at" him, since the shooter deliberately missed Edward Nigma with every shot.

#08. A Chinese gunsmith, known simply as "Gunsmith" as far as we can tell (he never got a single line of dialogue), was murdered on Mother's Day. (Apparently because he'd been selling custom-made .22 pistols each month or so to a special client -- but we don't know who!)

#09. Luigi Maroni, the retired father of crime boss Sal Maroni, was killed on Father's Day.

#10. Jasper Dolan, the Gotham City Coroner, was killed on July Fourth.

#11. Carla Viti (Johnny's mom and Carmine's sister) was killed in the City Coroner's office, apparently on her brother's birthday, August 2nd. (This is why that issue has the story title of "Roman Holiday" -- but you won't find that "holiday" marked on your calendar.)

#12. Sal Maroni was killed on Labor Day. (Alberto was caught in the act and promptly started confessing, so there's nothing ambiguous about who the shooter was in this one!)

#13. Harvey Dent used a .22 automatic ("Holiday's" trademark) to kill Vernon Field and Carmine Falcone on Halloween. (Again, there's no room for any reasonable doubt about who committed that -- pardon the expression -- "double-header" to wrap up the series of deaths on holidays.)

As to "confessions":

Gilda has "confessed" (in a monologue that only we readers "heard") to committing the first three of those crimes.

Alberto confessed to being Holiday -- in other words, he was implicitly confessing to having committed all of those murders, up through Labor Day (when he was caught). We were never given any reason to believe that he was disclaiming responsibility for any of the earlier murders (such as the ones Gilda claims she committed).

Harvey Dent made an enigmatic remark when he was being arrested right after killing The Roman. He said, "There were two Holiday killers." He didn't clarify his point. If he meant "even before I killed a couple of guys tonight," then he didn't offer any guidance on who the other killer was (besides Alberto), nor on how he (Harvey) knew about a "second Holiday killer" in the first place! (Granted: If he meant himself, his knowledge would be very easy to explain!)

#2 Elwood Hemingway

    Ramble on.

  • Blogger
  • PipPipPip
  • 3,546 posts
  • LocationCanada

Posted 10 November 2011 - 09:47 AM

It was Jeff Loeb, he made up a bullshit ending to a babbling story which he obviously had no real plan behind (ie. exactly like EVERY SINGLE story he's even written). Therefore, I say we just say "Jeff Loeb is an actual character who killed the others and the others who were seen on panel were copycats". It makes more sense than anything he's ever written.

Sorry. I really hate Jeff Loeb. And the Long Halloween. But mostly Loeb.

Posted Image




#3 Darren

    あいき よろしか

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 4,089 posts

Posted 10 November 2011 - 10:21 AM

You could pretty much substitute this for every Loeb story. Who is Hush? Who is Red Hulk? Meh. No-talent hack.


Posted Image





#4 Jolly Joe Gingerbeard

    Formerly known as Prime

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,759 posts

Posted 11 November 2011 - 08:02 PM

Not all of his work was bad. Superman for all Seasons and Spider-Man: Blue are not only some of my favorite stories, but fan and critical favorites, too.



Posted Image


#5 Darren

    あいき よろしか

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 4,089 posts

Posted 12 November 2011 - 02:47 AM

Superman for All Seasons wasn't awful I guess. I didn't like the meathead Superman. Still don't, but that's just my own preference. Spider Man: Blue.... The story's just a rewrite of a pretty famous episode in Parker's life. I'm not a fan of it (don't think I ever finished it) but Loeb was in safe waters there. It's when he's left to his own devices that he really dredges up the awful.


Posted Image





#6 M'onel

    The Flying Fool

  • Moderators
  • 1,941 posts
  • LocationThe Bright, Sunny South

Posted 12 November 2011 - 05:39 PM

Read Long Halloween once, remember....liking it, but can't vote on something like this because it's been too long and I can't remember half, if not most, of what occurred.

Posted Image






1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users